Talking To...John Timmins
Fatea has a long association with the Cowboy Junkies going way back to when we were a paper magazine. In the past we've spoken to Margo and Michael Timmins so when the opportunity came to speak to another Sibling, John, we leapt at the chance.
This interview was going to be different because the focus of the interview is a very different project, the release of the recording of the Amchitka Concert, often described as the concert that launched Greenpeace. John Timmins was the lucky man who got the job of bringing the recording back to life.
#JT= John Timmins #NK=Neil King
#NK You're over to promote the Greenpeace CD of the Amchitka Concert as well as being an occasional member of the Cowboy Junkies. How did the recycling of that concert come about? Also how did your work with the Cowboy Junkies influence your approach?
#JT The project has been in abeyance for a long time, almost since the concert. Greenpeace were aware that the tapes of the concert were held by the Stowe Family. The sleeve notes that accompany the release will make people aware, if they're not already, that the Stowe family is one of the founding families of Greenpeace. The problem was and has been for a long time, what to do with them. getting the permissions to make a record. When I joined Greenpeace a few years back, someone put two and two together, realised that I had a musical background. I was working in the fundraising part of Greenpeace at the time and it was thought that I might know how to get the permissions. When I was told this recording was in the Stowe's possession, I jumped at it, as you can imagine, and then got t work and that was about two years ago.
There was a lot of work in getting the various signoffs as well as everything else. There really were a lot of people involved and I think we're created a wonderful project.
#NK Absolutely and one thing I love about the release is that it feels of it's time, has that sense of it's self.
#JT It's of that time, exactly. That was something we didn't want to lose and could have if we hadn't stayed true to the ambient sound of the recording or if we'd packaged it differently. Greenpeace was of a mind that this was a very special time, not only in the origins of the organisation, but also in the world and the way it thought. We had to be true to it and as you're suggesting I think we captured that.
#NK It avoids the temptation of adding the extra glitter. It retains that you were there feel to it. Even if you weren't you can close your eyes and begin to believe that you were.
#JT One of the biggest concerns with putting together a live album is how much of the room, how much of the ambiance do you want to hear? It's especially important in a time when we want the goods now, quick, easy and clean. I had to consider all those things, but it was a no brainer. The times were so important to us and I thought that if we were true to the ambience you'd hear the time. You do, you hear certain sorts of comments in the audience. You hear the audience reacting; you can hear the technology on stage.
It was one microphone dragged around the stage. You cab hear Joni (Mitchell), actually rocking backwards and forwards in front of the microphone. There's a wave in the sound because her guitar is moving. All of that is so indicative of the set up, which is so characteristic of the time, the way the room responds. The mood I find exceptional. It's a real....it's almost a touchstone to that time.
#NK It's a real transition period, on the cusp Phil Ochs was just starting the downward slide and it's like he's handing on the baton to the next generation, from singing to highlight an issue to being active in working on that issue.
#JT I think you're right and I think you're suggesting why this concert was so important. It's not the only concert that was held at that time, in those two or three years, '69 to '72, but it is a concert that does show that. It is the transition from protest singer to singer/songwriter, with the singer/songwriter still carrying a lot of that protest as well. Bob Dylan was also developing along the Joni and James (Taylor) theme as well, but he was also influenced by the likes of Phil and the other protest singers. I think it's a wonderful transition and it's led to a beautiful hybrid that's lead to the hard edged folk/protest song having a greater sensitivity to it. It goes deep and it's introspective, but there's a lot of strength in that.
#NK Also one thing that the package and it's sleeve notes brings to me...I'm of an age where Greenpeace has always been there, been part of my growing up, been part of my protests in the past and now. Listening and reading this makes you realise how close it was to being stillborn.
#JT I genuinely believe that that gap would have been filled, if not Greenpeace, something else, maybe like Greenpeace, certainly in the space.
#NK And with Friends Of The Earth coming out of Canada, it was like giving a second string to the environmental bow.
#JT I think the organisation has grown up well from its early Canadian days. There have been a number of stages, but it's always done so by remaining true to its principles. From the early days, through the internal political struggles, to today, it's always kept to the principles of nonviolent protest and bearing witness.
#NK Back to the album. Two of the performers on the album are still alive, if there was an issue, you could go back to the source. Were there any additional complications with Phil Ochs, whose been dead awhile?
JT Not at all. There was a real advantage in that all the performers were singular singer/songwriters. I didn't have to get full band approvals with all the legal ramifications that brings. Joni is pretty much in control of her work and James is too. It was quite easy in terms of the legalities; it just took time because they have a lot of demands on their lives. We'd already waited a very long time so we were happy to lose some more time and get it right. Even today I'm still in ouch. As we try and share this record with more people around the world, they are very much still on side and very supportive of what we've done.The Ochs family/estate was very obliging. They were the first people to come onboard. We already had that to run with when we went to James and Joni. I dealt with Phil's daughter Megan Leigh Ochs and Michael Ochs, his brother. They couldn't be nicer people and they couldn't be more supportive. It was literally, "The project sounds great, we are very much onside with Greenpeace so go for it and we'll be here to cross the ts and dot the i's."
#NK It also gives the chance to give the Phil Ochs legacy to a wider world, not that I'm for one minute suggesting that's a reason for it, more that it's another bonus of the recording.
#JT I need to admit that I personally didn't know too much about Phil Ochs before getting involved with this, my music really starts with the James Taylor/Joni Mitchell generation. I've gone back a lot more since, but I think there's more coming at me about Phil Ochs now than any other musician. More people want to talk to me about their experiences with Phil, how much they love his music. It's really wonderful and it indicates that there is a huge pool of knowledge and respect around the man and his music, what he stood for and that's very exciting.
photo credits:
Pic 1 - John Timmins (right), producer, Amchitka, the 1970 concert that launched Greenpeace presents Rex Weyler, original Greenpeace campaigner, author, columnist - www.greenpeace.org/international/about/deep-green with a framed Amchitka CD poster for his work on the CD while Bruce Cox, executive director, Greenpeace Canada, looks on. Photo credit Alan Katowitz
Pic 2 - Phil Ochs